Originally posted by superniceguyYou post something, it may get done / noticed. You post nothing, then nothing gets done. It is never a waste of time. It is therapuetic to get it off your chest, but where it goes pear shaped is when people start bashing your wishes, and then it usually turns into a flame war /argumenat and then the devs do ignore it, and nothing happens, and then people are less likely to bother posting what they think are improvements to avoid confrontation, and that is why supporters are what is what is wrong.
Originally posted by lizardbones?Forumites get up in arms about everything. People blindly attack a game and people blindly defend a game. Pointing out that the forums brought up an issue is like pointing out that Twitter points to relevant data. If you try to highlight everything, then you're going to highlight something. The difference between a developer reading a forum and us is that they have a lot of additional information that nobody else has access to.For instance, concerning the cash shop, there are a hundred or even a thousand people on the forums screaming about every detail of the cash shop, and how it's horrible, ruined gaming, or just an all around bad deal. You have another hundred or a thousand people saying the exact opposite. In the meantime, you have fifty thousand people buying stuff from the cash shop. The additional information that the developer has access to is the important information, not the forums. The forums are just a blip on the radar, telling the developer they might want to examine something further.Now, none of this applies if the developer asks, "What do you guys think about X?" At that point, the forums become the most important bit of information. Because there's always an exception. :-)?
Originally posted by superniceguyIt mattered to SOE, most of what was said on the forums was listened to, and chnaged accordingly. They did not see the point of camps but they brought it back nonetheless.?You are probably right though with EA, but it does not help when you get people blindly defending the crap going on with the game, and it turns into arguments.
Originally posted by lizardbones ?You've made the assumption that what gets said on forums actually matters. If you are saying anything on forums with the expectation that it's going to change anything, you are wasting whatever time you're putting into that effort. In the rare case that a developer listens to something said in the forums, it's because it mirrors other data that they have and it actually reflects what many players think. This is pretty rare. EA aren't shysters. They delivered exactly what they said they would deliver. That doesn't mean it's a good deal, and it doesn't mean they'll make money off of what they've offered, but they aren't shysters. Nobody in this thread is the problem with the industry, or the solution. They aren't even representative of the problem or the solution. The millions of people who buy MMOs and then stick with them or leave are the only ones who matter. ?
Originally posted by colddog04Hopefully the people in charge of this game are at some point held accountable for their bad decisions so that they don't infect other games with their undeserved prominence. ? ? The more that people like you defend these shysters, the less likely they are to be held accountable. ? Supporters like you are what is wrong with the MMO industry. Get over it and move along to a game you ENJOY. ? /fist beat chest,eve isk, then held in air ?
Originally posted by Darklighter1 I'll never understand why posts like this exist.? Seriously, play the game...or don't.? Wishing the game fails......people lose their jobs?? You claim this game is what's wrong with the MMO industry.? ? Hate mongers like you people are what is wrong with the MMO industry.? Get over it and move along to a game you ENJOY.The Meatlump Theme Park was put into SWG, from an ongoing joke on the forums. People wondered about the Meatlump King, and people messed around saying you can find him but was not in game at all. Then one day the SOE devs decided to do a Meatlump Theme park from it.
I'm starting to think I understand why SWG has such a devoted following.
Anyway, as I said, when targeting issues, forums bring up everything. If it's possible to complain about or support something, it happens on the forums. As much as it feels like a contest though, it's not. Developers don't count the number of people who like and hate an issue in the forums and then act on it. They see what gets brought up, then look for information outside the forums to support that the issue exists. There's almost always some metric in a game that supports or refutes that an issue exists, or that it's a priority. They might see something in their metrics and then go to the forums to see if anyone has noticed the issue.
The example relevant to this thread would be the cash shop. A thousand people on the forums complain because the holiday items are only available in the cash shop. Meanwhile, fifty thousand or a hundred thousand people buy the holiday items off the cash shop, and those aren't people who post on the forums. The people who say the cash shop is fine on the forums really don't matter. The cash shop is fine, because it does what it was intended to do, which is earn money. Now, if very few people buy something off the cash shop, and very few people buy any holiday items, then the forum has highlighted an issue, and if the developer is sane, they'll do something about it. Again, the people who support the cash shop in the forums don't matter.
The scenario you're highlighting (major issues get drowned out by supporters) doesn't happen though. There aren't so many people who support a game no matter what that the people who bring up issues are drowned out and unheard. If that scenario does happen, the game doesn't have any issues, other than what they're going to do with all their money. Minor issues could get drowned out, but they could get drowned out by major issues rather than supporters. Besides, there's usually a major issue that would take priority.
The exceptions would be cases where the developer doesn't have metrics outside the forums to pull from. Things that don't currently exist in the game would fall under this category. Things that did exist in the game, and which would cost the developer very few resources to implement for good will from the players might fall into this category as well. I think forums are really useful, and in general they are good, but they aren't the battleground for the future of a game. SoE seems to have taken advantage of this, to good effect.
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The other exception would be things that aren't actually issues, but matters of preference. If a mechanic isn't actually causing any issues in terms of players staying or leaving, or spending money on the game, then the developer could check the forums to see if more players like a feature or dislike a feature. If more players like a feature (camps in SWG), then it makes sense that a developer would implement (or remove) said feature.
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